Comments on: You're a mug if you just get the Rohypnol http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/ the blog that is not dansdata.com Sun, 06 Dec 2009 21:34:36 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=1.5.1-alpha by: Jonadab http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-4004 Sun, 11 Jan 2009 22:04:39 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-4004 The big problem with heroin isn't the addictiveness. It's significantly less addictive than nicotine, or cocaine for that matter, and probably not more addictive than morphine. But heroin can mess you up permanently even if you only use it once. That's why it's illegal in the US, even though morphine, which is related and probably just as addictive, is legal for prescription use. Morphine's side-effects are less dangerous. (The medical community does watch use of morphine rather closely, because of concerns about addiction, and most doctors try not to prescribe it for long-term use or when something else will do.) The big problem with heroin isn't the addictiveness. It's significantly less addictive than nicotine, or cocaine for that matter, and probably not more addictive than morphine. But heroin can mess you up permanently even if you only use it once. That's why it's illegal in the US, even though morphine, which is related and probably just as addictive, is legal for prescription use. Morphine's side-effects are less dangerous. (The medical community does watch use of morphine rather closely, because of concerns about addiction, and most doctors try not to prescribe it for long-term use or when something else will do.)

]]> by: phrantic http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3945 Tue, 06 Jan 2009 17:10:47 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3945 And that, unfunk, has become my new MSN "personal message". There really should be a bash.org for blog comments. And that, unfunk, has become my new MSN "personal message". There really should be a bash.org for blog comments.

]]> by: unfunk http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3934 Mon, 05 Jan 2009 13:00:39 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3934 I dunno.. I think I could subsist on a diet of pure opiods. Maybe not for long, but I probably wouldn't care... I dunno.. I think I could subsist on a diet of pure opiods. Maybe not for long, but I probably wouldn't care...

]]> by: Red October http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3932 Sun, 04 Jan 2009 12:53:58 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3932 Sucks worse to be my boss. He's allergic to everything BUT pure opiods. Sucks worse to be my boss. He's allergic to everything BUT pure opiods.

]]> by: unfunk http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3931 Sat, 03 Jan 2009 22:57:33 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3931 yeah, a small percentage of people are allergic to opioids. Sucks to be them, I say. yeah, a small percentage of people are allergic to opioids. Sucks to be them, I say.

]]> by: dr_w00t http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3930 Sat, 03 Jan 2009 20:59:55 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3930 When my fiance was hit by a car they jacked her full of Morphine. The sickness that it caused was more traumatic than the injuries caused by the accident (no broken bones or serious internal injuries, just lots of brusing)... she was vomitting blood for hours. When my fiance was hit by a car they jacked her full of Morphine. The sickness that it caused was more traumatic than the injuries caused by the accident (no broken bones or serious internal injuries, just lots of brusing)... she was vomitting blood for hours.

]]> by: Krash http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3926 Sat, 03 Jan 2009 11:39:38 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3926 "Heroin, on the other hand… I can’t imagine a legitimate doctor wanting to give that stuff to a non-terminal patient." Au contraire, heroin is a fantastic painkiller. Anaesthesia is chock to the rafters full of opium-derived and synthetic opioid agents. Codeine to Morphine, Propofol to Oxycodone. Patients in hospitals the world over are packed to the gills with heroin-related drugs. Each has a slightly different role (works faster, works longer, can be taken orally, is stronger but more sedating, etc) Heroin has (unless my memory eludes me) the honour of being the fastest acting opioid. Inject a little of the stuff into your veins, and in the time it takes the blood in your arm to get somewhere near your brain or spine, the stuff has kicked in, and you're full of a warm fuzzy feeling. The downside of a drug that kicks in this fast, is that often the comedown is just as quick. When the nice feeling goes away all at once, leaving you with an upset stomach and a headache, the thing our mind wants is to get away from the negative feeling - Easy, it thinks. That heroin stuff we used before made me feel nice, and it made me feel nice FAST. Better have some more of that. This is the basis of psychological addiction - the brain is associating the action with the desire, before the body associates the chemical with a biological need. (The other well known, fast acting opioid, Propofol, doesn't have this problem, for two reasons. The first, it needs to be given by infusion. A minute after the last drop goes in your arm, it's all gone away. Second, it's really quite sedating, which is why it's used in surgery (and also quite often, more minor procedures like colonoscopy). Your brain is too tired to make the association between feeling nice and that IV line full of stuff that looks like curdling milk. From a medical standpoint, none of these drugs are terribly addictive - meaning that it takes quite a bit of use for your body to decide that it's getting enough of that chemical from outside, that it doesn't need to bother making any of its own anymore (yes, your body makes it's own morphine). Heroin is probably the worst of them, followed closely by morphine, but the frequency that even long-stay hospital patients receieving morphine go on to develop even a small opioid addiction (such as just always wanting Codeine in your paracetamol) is less than 1%. The rate of these patients going on to require long term strong (e.g oxycodone) opioids is less than 0.1%. And the rate of these patients going on to develop C'mon-man-my-arms-are-itchy-I-need-a-fix-how-much-will-you-give-me-for-my-mother heroin addiction is approaching zero (never heard of a case myself, but that certainly doesn't meen it hasn't happened) Heroin as a painkiller is great. You need instant pain relief but your patient more or less conscious? Heroin is your guy. Due to it's potential for psychological addiction, it'd would need to be strictly supervised use, but in a situation where that much pain control is necessary, there's going to be alot of people around. All that being said, between heroin's illicit nature, all the stigma against it, our common heavy duty drug of choice is still the next best thing, our little old pal Morphine. Whew, that turned into a full-on blog post... "Heroin, on the other hand… I can’t imagine a legitimate doctor wanting to give that stuff to a non-terminal patient."
Au contraire, heroin is a fantastic painkiller.
Anaesthesia is chock to the rafters full of opium-derived and synthetic opioid agents. Codeine to Morphine, Propofol to Oxycodone. Patients in hospitals the world over are packed to the gills with heroin-related drugs. Each has a slightly different role (works faster, works longer, can be taken orally, is stronger but more sedating, etc)
Heroin has (unless my memory eludes me) the honour of being the fastest acting opioid. Inject a little of the stuff into your veins, and in the time it takes the blood in your arm to get somewhere near your brain or spine, the stuff has kicked in, and you're full of a warm fuzzy feeling.
The downside of a drug that kicks in this fast, is that often the comedown is just as quick. When the nice feeling goes away all at once, leaving you with an upset stomach and a headache, the thing our mind wants is to get away from the negative feeling - Easy, it thinks. That heroin stuff we used before made me feel nice, and it made me feel nice FAST. Better have some more of that.
This is the basis of psychological addiction - the brain is associating the action with the desire, before the body associates the chemical with a biological need.
(The other well known, fast acting opioid, Propofol, doesn't have this problem, for two reasons. The first, it needs to be given by infusion. A minute after the last drop goes in your arm, it's all gone away. Second, it's really quite sedating, which is why it's used in surgery (and also quite often, more minor procedures like colonoscopy). Your brain is too tired to make the association between feeling nice and that IV line full of stuff that looks like curdling milk.

From a medical standpoint, none of these drugs are terribly addictive - meaning that it takes quite a bit of use for your body to decide that it's getting enough of that chemical from outside, that it doesn't need to bother making any of its own anymore (yes, your body makes it's own morphine). Heroin is probably the worst of them, followed closely by morphine, but the frequency that even long-stay hospital patients receieving morphine go on to develop even a small opioid addiction (such as just always wanting Codeine in your paracetamol) is less than 1%. The rate of these patients going on to require long term strong (e.g oxycodone) opioids is less than 0.1%. And the rate of these patients going on to develop C'mon-man-my-arms-are-itchy-I-need-a-fix-how-much-will-you-give-me-for-my-mother heroin addiction is approaching zero (never heard of a case myself, but that certainly doesn't meen it hasn't happened)

Heroin as a painkiller is great. You need instant pain relief but your patient more or less conscious? Heroin is your guy. Due to it's potential for psychological addiction, it'd would need to be strictly supervised use, but in a situation where that much pain control is necessary, there's going to be alot of people around.

All that being said, between heroin's illicit nature, all the stigma against it, our common heavy duty drug of choice is still the next best thing, our little old pal Morphine.

Whew, that turned into a full-on blog post...

]]> by: phrantic http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3925 Sat, 03 Jan 2009 10:18:54 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3925 You know how it is. Got to keep exercising your botnet. Keep it in peak physical condition. You know how it is. Got to keep exercising your botnet. Keep it in peak physical condition.

]]> by: Jonadab http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3924 Sat, 03 Jan 2009 09:46:04 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3924 Cocaine is a lot less dangerous than heroin, IMO. I suspect the main reason it's illegal is because it's highly addictive, and of course long-term use will mess you up, as is true of most drugs. But using it once for anesthesia during a medical procedure, such as a surgery? No big deal. Heroin, on the other hand... I can't imagine a legitimate doctor wanting to give that stuff to a non-terminal patient. As for the spammers: obviously they're not really going to send you the drugs, but do they even provide enough contact information that you could actually send them money if you wanted to? I've seen a lot of spam that doesn't appear to advertise any particular product and also doesn't provide *any* way for you to get back to them. I get markov-chain mail with an obviously forged source address pretty often, for instance. The best working hypothesis I've come up with so far is that spammers have slow days with nothing really profitable to send, so they send out random junk just because they *can*. Cocaine is a lot less dangerous than heroin, IMO. I suspect the main reason it's illegal is because it's highly addictive, and of course long-term use will mess you up, as is true of most drugs. But using it once for anesthesia during a medical procedure, such as a surgery? No big deal. Heroin, on the other hand... I can't imagine a legitimate doctor wanting to give that stuff to a non-terminal patient.

As for the spammers: obviously they're not really going to send you the drugs, but do they even provide enough contact information that you could actually send them money if you wanted to? I've seen a lot of spam that doesn't appear to advertise any particular product and also doesn't provide *any* way for you to get back to them. I get markov-chain mail with an obviously forged source address pretty often, for instance. The best working hypothesis I've come up with so far is that spammers have slow days with nothing really profitable to send, so they send out random junk just because they *can*.

]]> by: Red October http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3923 Fri, 02 Jan 2009 15:32:02 +0000 http://dansdata.blogsome.com/2009/01/01/youre-a-mug-if-you-just-get-the-rohypnol/#comment-3923 That's funny, Fuzzy, most people I know are already familiar with Heroin's legitimate use in the UK, but are completely surprised when I inform them that Cocaine is still available by prescription. It is excellent for certain surgical procedures because it will both numb the area and constrict the blood vessels, thus diminishing bleeding. Because it is used as a topical anaesthestic, I doubt one could get a "take home" prescription for it. That's funny, Fuzzy, most people I know are already familiar with Heroin's legitimate use in the UK, but are completely surprised when I inform them that Cocaine is still available by prescription. It is excellent for certain surgical procedures because it will both numb the area and constrict the blood vessels, thus diminishing bleeding. Because it is used as a topical anaesthestic, I doubt one could get a "take home" prescription for it.

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